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August 19, 2011

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WilliamCB

This is a council of despair. And I say that as someone who agrees 100% with your points about complexity and the difficulty of drawing straight lines back to causes.

Lots of the explanations might be glib and shallow as you say. But even the worst have one virtue your approach doesn't - they are the start of identifying things that we *could* do about it. "Shit happens" gets us nowhere.

Marbury

It's not a counsel of despair, it is a counsel of calm. It's a way of saying, let's not have our policy-making determined by random events (see Jerram on the peril of 'crisis-ifying').

WilliamCB

Now you seem to be saying that complex = random = causeless. It still doesn't add up.

kb

I find myself increasingly drawn to what might crudely be called the "shit happens" hypothesis.

I guess we can close down the sociology and economics departments then. And why not history and psychology while we're at it. If we go on at this rate we'll soon only be left with divinity. Which, appropriately, is where you started.

Has a crowd of happy people ever rioted? There's one variable to get you started. I suspect many of the people cited above are rather worried by what a thorough analysis might produce.

John

Not surprised by Louise. Or the rioters reaction to her. It's the puerile white middle class who run the country who have lost all sense of direction. Sally Bercow is on BB to give the fingers to the establishment. What does she think the Speaker's wife is?!

Ariel Adam

Misbehaving is fun. Nobody wants to think about that, they just want to blame something other than human nature.

I'd recommend that everyone go out knock a policeman's helmet off, then scarper. Once a month should be about enough.

John W

We might as well do nothing about anything then because we know nothing. The Mystic Masseur. Somehow I suspect the "shit happens" theory has ideology at it's heart as well. Nobody is to blame so let's carry on as we are.

Marbury

John, as I say above, my point is that policy-making should not be overly determined by events like this. That's emphatically not the same as saying the government shouldn't have policies. I'm not even saying the riots aren't significant. I'm cautioning against over-confident over-interpretations of them, of which there's a lot about.

simon kane

To describe a riot as a "random event" is not really a council of calm. The "short memory" argument is a nonsense to anyone who remembers the constant civil broils of the Thatcher years, and the peace that followed. Nobody's saying policy-making should be "overly" determined by riots, but I would argue that not having a riot in the first place should always play some part in the policy-making.

Elemjay

I don't think the riots have to "mean" anything. I think it's a bunch of kids trying it on, and not getting stopped fast by the police. School holidays and social networking/ mobile phones made it easier to muster big groups. Areas that have a lot of shops near areas of deprivation (like Clapham Junction) seem to have been particularly affected.

Actually the big questions seems to be not "why did we have riots" but "why do we not have MORE riots?". It's clearly pretty easy to get going, and once started somewhat hard to stop. Amazing we don't have more of them really....

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